Tony Veciana dying - gives important Deathbed Confession!

[Leslie Sharp]

". . . Thus the CIA did not anticipate the President's assassination but it was responsible for it. I share that guilt." DAP

Emphasis on Phillips' statement skirts into controversial territory where the CIA should only be implicated by reason of their failure to halt Oswald's murderous and lone intentions.   

Credible researchers/journalists (ie. Jeff Morley) seem to be leading many of the uninformed down that path, albeit in good faith. 

Reading Phillips' well-published comments before his death, and assuming that record is credible, I'm wondering.  I'm wondering why would he not have owned this alleged and highly limited responsibility long before he did if all that was at stake was the agency's reputation.  The Nation would have gotten over it ... in fact it did, time and time again. 

The CIA's simple failure to inhibit the assassin would be a unifying resolution:  those who believe Oswald acted alone would certainly be satisfied; those who believe that the CIA was involved would be vindicated, assuaged by an admission of mal or misfeasance by the agency. 

It's a win-win proposition, and one that Americans have been indoctrinated into accepting at the expense of truth.  It's all about Process, after all.


". . . I think from the evidence we have it is more correct to say that DAP was ONE of MANY of Oswald's handlers near the end of his life ..."

This speaks to the expanse of the conspiracy and cover up, something none of us should dismiss as mere dot connecting.

[Peter Lemkin]

". . . Thus the CIA did not anticipate the President's assassination but it was responsible for it. I share that guilt." DAP

Emphasis on Phillips' statement skirts into controversial territory where the CIA should only be implicated by reason of their failure to halt Oswald's murderous and lone intentions.   

Credible researchers/journalists (ie. Jeff Morley) seem to be leading many of the uninformed down that path, albeit in good faith. 

Reading Phillips' well-published comments before his death, and assuming that record is credible, I'm wondering.  I'm wondering why would he not have owned this alleged and highly limited responsibility long before he did if all that was at stake was the agency's reputation.  The Nation would have gotten over it ... in fact it did, time and time again. 

The CIA's simple failure to inhibit the assassin would be a unifying resolution:  those who believe Oswald acted alone would certainly be satisfied; those who believe that the CIA was involved would be vindicated, assuaged by an admission of mal or misfeasance by the agency. 

It's a win-win proposition, and one that Americans have been indoctrinated into accepting at the expense of truth.  It's all about Process, after all.


". . . I think from the evidence we have it is more correct to say that DAP was ONE of MANY of Oswald's handlers near the end of his life ..."

This speaks to the expanse of the conspiracy and cover up, something none of us should dismiss as mere dot connecting.

The CIA [or more accurately some within it, along some of its off-the-shelf 'deniable' operatives] were as innocent as Oswald was guilty. It was NOT the only grouping/entity/intelligence agency involved. However, it played a major role in the intricate planning and coordination, as well as its cover-up and confusion purposely left behind to cover the tracks of all the conspirators. Phillips, Angleton, Harvey, Shackley, Morales, Helms, Dulles, Lansdale [both CIA and MI], Hoover, some in the JCS, some around JFK, some in the Military and MI, some in the SS, some in the Mafia, some in the far Right, some Oligarchs and corporate bigwigs, and others were all involved in the planning, deeds, and cover-up. Who initiated it and how it exactly spread into all these 'compartments' is only partly known; however, each had their own reasons [many overlapping] to want JFK dead and the USA secretly captured in a Coup under their general control....which it is to this very day, IMO...even if they are dead...minus one or two....the Coup continues and every President, Congress, Supreme Court etc. since has been captives of that Coup....I fear the Constitution itself.

[Leslie Sharp]

Naming names is daunting, particularly when weighing the ethics of doing so against the overriding need to uncover precisely who made the decision, who carried it out, and who covered it up.  I do think in addition to Peter's list, it's important to develop a list of military leaders who might be at the very least responsible for assisting in the cover up (witting or not) by their passivity following the assassination of their Commander in Chief; to that end, it is worth studying men like Fred Korth, Arleigh Burke, George Olmsted, Robert Anderson, and James Douglas among others to recognize the positions they held, and the blind (perhaps) loyalty that held them together as they failed to pursue the conspiracy.

Another factor is understanding how the various compartments interacted, and to that end, who masterminded the plot, soup to nuts.  Many have half-jokingly suggested that a magician or group of same was behind the whole thing.   I stumbled onto several individuals who meet a specific criteria to fill that role, holding serious affiliations with deep power over the intelligence apparatus, the industrial support complex, atomic proliferation, NATO, the media, and most important, the scene of the crime, Dallas.  Unfortunately, their descendants are alive and well, and not only would it be wrong to directly accuse without concrete facts to support the theory, naming them could have legal ramifications for any forum.  How to pursue this but avoid those issues is a dilemma.  But should it be ignored when it speaks to who had the skills to pull it all together - the decision, the execution, the cover up.

Some suggest Angleton, which I reject.  He fills at least one of the roles, "Who had the power to execute," but in spite of his connections with Washington and his legendary intel skills, could he silence the rest of the nations' media without serious support from on high?  Would he actually have made the final decision without the blessing of some with far deeper power than he? 

I think that it took some group with the skills of a magician, operating in deep background, to take the final order, to orchestrate the execution, and to manage the cover up.

[TLR]

Bill O'Reilly back in the day reporting about Veciana and Phillips:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvdS-1dcVxw

[Alan Dale]

Posted by forum member Dave Curbow

The complaints about the MSM are unwarranted. From their perspective, they have a hearsay document, unnotorized, written by a man with an obvious grudge, Robert T, and revealing information that the MSM would have to extensively educate their audience in order for the public to understand its importance.
And as explosive as this document appears to be, it still doesn't prove anything beyond Phillips being guilty of perjury. Because I have focused my reading mostly on the plaza over the past few years, I would need to review Fonzi's book. But the document alone doesn't prove a conspiracy.
What it does is or should do, if verified, is increase the pressure on congress to release the remainder of the Joannides file. I presume Jefferson is actively perusing this. But if he does, he darn well better have that document verified, notarized, and even resigned on camera capturing all the steps necessary for authentication.
Because if this is a set up to discredit conspiracy theories and is lauded by those of us who are suspicious, when revealed it will seriously discredit those who are clamoring for more information. And those behind the set up are obviously going to jump for joy, their mission accomplished.
Using the MSM as a whipping boy is simply a strawman.

My two cents and that is probably inflated value.

Dave

[Peter Lemkin]

Posted by forum member Dave Curbow

The complaints about the MSM are unwarranted. From their perspective, they have a hearsay document, unnotorized, written by a man with an obvious grudge, Robert T, and revealing information that the MSM would have to extensively educate their audience in order for the public to understand its importance.
And as explosive as this document appears to be, it still doesn't prove anything beyond Phillips being guilty of perjury. Because I have focused my reading mostly on the plaza over the past few years, I would need to review Fonzi's book. But the document alone doesn't prove a conspiracy.
What it does is or should do, if verified, is increase the pressure on congress to release the remainder of the Joannides file. I presume Jefferson is actively perusing this. But if he does, he darn well better have that document verified, notarized, and even resigned on camera capturing all the steps necessary for authentication.
Because if this is a set up to discredit conspiracy theories and is lauded by those of us who are suspicious, when revealed it will seriously discredit those who are clamoring for more information. And those behind the set up are obviously going to jump for joy, their mission accomplished.
Using the MSM as a whipping boy is simply a strawman.

My two cents and that is probably inflated value.

Dave

You say the document 'doesn't prove a conspiracy'. I beg to differ. Not that we need one more proof of a conspiracy - that has been established a few thousand times over; however, anyone who understands who Phillips was and his meeting with 'lone-nut' Oswald days before the assassination, taken with everything else we know......may not 'PROVE' a conspiracy [alone, for legal purposes in Court].....but it all but shows yet again that the conspiracy was massive, at the highest levels and, most importantly, STILL ONGOING [with the continued cover-up; denial of documents, et al.] Yes, it would be nice if they got it notarized, but we have no venue yet to have any legal process. I have long suggested one outside the USA be used in some country with universal jurisdiction [there are several]. The USA is still under the Coup of 11/22/63 (which IMHO was made only stronger with the alter-coup of 9-11-01) and thus the powers that be will never allow a real honest investigation of what happened in either [and many mini-coups in between]. Never. They'd resort to marital law or nuking their own Nation before they'd admit the perfidy of their actions all these years. Too bad the Sheeple are not willing to throw the bums out en masse and start over....but they are dumbed-down, propagandized, confused, more interested in the bread and circus, and know almost nothing of history - even their own. Sadly. Its going to take a [r]evolution! I'm for a non-violent one....but as King said "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."

[Phil Dragoo]

I find Antonio Veciana's simple and to the point statement entirely consistent with his comments to Gaetaon Fonzi.  Phillips would also work with McCord running Oswald against the Fair Play for Cuba Committee.

And speaking of death bed limited hangouts, David Atlee Phillips answered his brother's question, "Were you in Dallas that day?" with a sobbing, "Yes."

Why sobbing.  Was he cutting onions?

What a grand load of poppycock comes from the CIA's Western Hemisphere chief, the man who would form the Association of Former Intelligence Officers, that "we trained him to kill Castro but he killed Kennedy instead"--even when these schlubs pretend to tell the truth it is merely another limited hangout.

Did Angleton run the false defector program.  Oswald was one of the score.  Marina confused him with Robert Webster.  Why did Angleton so abuse Nosenko--because Nosenko was blowing up the Red Scare, big time, just as Castro the next day smelled CIA

Was Dulles reshaping CIA from Truman's signature on the 1947 National Security Act--why, yes, yes he was.  CIA was the sword and shield of the cabal.  Resource exploitation facilitated by regime change.  Iran.  Guatemala.  Indonesia.  Congo.  To the extent Agee wrote Inside the Company

But Nixon was not elected and the White House was an obstacle.  Bay of Pigs was a provocation--did Dulles really think Kennedy would send the Essex' planes?  Was it Bundy who blocked the last raid by B-26's Kennedy ordered? 

The result was an army of willing assassins, as though Op 40 and JMWAVE and executive action and ZRRIFLE and Operation Mongoose and Operation Northwoods and a sneak attack on the Soviet Union and a LeMay HE orgasm October '62 went hot with the speech at American University June '63

JFK's comptroller of currency struggled in vain to reform the Fed so powerful was David Rockefeller of Chase Manhattan.  EO 11110 of June '63 was undone after the caisson and riderless horse were stabled

And voila Bundy pulls NSAM 273 out of where he sits for LBJ's signature the Tuesday after the Monday funeral

At our liesure we will put the names and faces on the board

I stipulate the business model was in use when Dulles was in Switzerland in '17 as German military sent Lenin to Petrograd

When Dulles was in Paris and Germany in the 'Thirties getting loans for Germany and downplaying the threat of Hitler

OSS comrades continued into CIA, Angleton, Dulles, Helms, et al as Yalta set up the bipolar lookingglass "cold" war

JFK was not allowed to end it--his secret negotiations were surveilled--even as today the NSA and other tentacles reach into every space and communication--

The military leadership, the intelligence leadership, many or most insiders in government were willing handmaidens to the removal of the obstacle to the model

After the murder, the Vietnam War and the Golden Triangle flowed

And who has dictated the thaw with Iran--the fellows who dictated the need for Southeast Asia:  Henry Kissinger and David Rockefeller and others of their level unnamed

The CIA and military today interfere in the Mexican drug war--look at what Scott and Kruger have revealed

The CIA and military today interfere in the Operation Arab Spring

So it was with removing Kennedy, with collapsing the towers, all Northwoods all the time

From a literary-tactical standpoint, Harvey and his special teams were the state of the art; Op 40 did assassination wholesale

Dulles calls in Hunt for collaboration November 1961 as Dulles is driven from HIS agency by the nouveau poseur

"That little Kennedy. . .he thought he was a god"

Phillips was a soldier--that he died of natural causes means he obeyed all orders and questioned none

That Veciana outed him in the heat of the 'seventies and with his last breaths is a testament to his passion for freedom

Ayers was a rich-kid playacting toasting Chavez in Caracas in 2006 "viva la revolucion bolivariana!  Hasta la victoria siempre!"

Veciana is the real deal, and like his mortal enemy Castro, knows how the CIA rolls